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 Sniper to appeal execution
selena
Posted: Nov 11 2009, 04:37 PM


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QUOTE (steve @ Nov 11 2009, 02:44 PM)

Ah, again, underlying causes. How come you never seem to care about the underlying causes of why Israel takes military actions against Gaza or Hezbollah?

Are you so sure I don't care? Or, is that your perception because I take offense at countries who have power and weapons coming down hard on those who don't have the same advantage?

You don't mind killing a Gulf War Veteran who kills civilians but you admire leaders who kill others for political gains. I am at a loss to understand the logic of those who can separate killing into neat compartments. If you are there you can kill with impunity; if you are here you can't. You know what? Some people just can't get over killing, even if they kill in war. They are haunted by trying to understand the difference.

It is the same logic as making a big deal out of one group's getting killed and ignoring other groups who suffer the same fate.


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steve
Posted: Nov 11 2009, 05:54 PM


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QUOTE (selena @ Nov 11 2009, 04:37 PM)
QUOTE (steve @ Nov 11 2009, 02:44 PM)

Ah, again, underlying causes. How come you never seem to care about the underlying causes of why Israel takes military actions against Gaza or Hezbollah?

Are you so sure I don't care? Or, is that your perception because I take offense at countries who have power and weapons coming down hard on those who don't have the same advantage?

You don't mind killing a Gulf War Veteran who kills civilians but you admire leaders who kill others for political gains. I am at a loss to understand the logic of those who can separate killing into neat compartments. If you are there you can kill with impunity; if you are here you can't. You know what? Some people just can't get over killing, even if they kill in war. They are haunted by trying to understand the difference.

It is the same logic as making a big deal out of one group's getting killed and ignoring other groups who suffer the same fate.

If someone were "haunted" by war, do you really think they would modify a car to hide in a car trunk, and shoot random strangers in the head with a high powered rifle?

I'd think someone haunted might take up drugs, or drinking, or something else, but not going on a murderous rampage. We don't need to understand the man. He was pure evil and is now dead.
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selena
Posted: Nov 11 2009, 07:30 PM


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QUOTE (steve @ Nov 11 2009, 05:54 PM)

If someone were "haunted" by war, do you really think they would modify a car to hide in a car trunk, and shoot random strangers in the head with a high powered rifle?

I'd think someone haunted might take up drugs, or drinking, or something else, but not going on a murderous rampage. We don't need to understand the man. He was pure evil and is now dead.

Steve, no one knows how the mind will react to traumatic events.

As for pure evil, he is just on example of pure evil. Pure evil can always excuse its own actions.


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Dan
Posted: Nov 12 2009, 06:57 PM


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I watched Oprah one night where a condemned murderer was being interviewed and he was also talking with his children.
A chill went across me as this murderer was ice cold and emotionless despite that this was the last time he would see or talk to his children.
To me that is evil as was his henious murder of several people all at once.
Selena there was no traumatic event, no PRE-traumatic stress syndrome (Dr. Phil is an idiot) and no Geraldo he did not have a bad toothache. You cannot "understand" and "excuse" every vile act of murder.


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Bob in Queensland
Posted: Nov 12 2009, 07:09 PM


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Did anyone say they understand or excuse the Washington sniper? I certainly don't...and didn't say so.

What I DID say is that his execution achieves nothing other than revenge. The victims are no more alive, the world is no safer than if he was in a top security mental hospital and if you want to talk about deterrent...well, capital punishment does NOT deter anyone, least of all nut cases like the sniper or the next person who goes bonkers and shoots up his school/workplace/bunch of strangers.

If you think you can justify revenge, go ahead and try. Otherwise, what has the execution achieved?


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Dan
Posted: Nov 12 2009, 07:29 PM


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QUOTE (Bob in Queensland @ Nov 12 2009, 07:09 PM)
Did anyone say they understand or excuse the Washington sniper? I certainly don't...and didn't say so.

What I DID say is that his execution achieves nothing other than revenge. The victims are no more alive, the world is no safer than if he was in a top security mental hospital and if you want to talk about deterrent...well, capital punishment does NOT deter anyone, least of all nut cases like the sniper or the next person who goes bonkers and shoots up his school/workplace/bunch of strangers.

If you think you can justify revenge, go ahead and try. Otherwise, what has the execution achieved?

Bob,
Capital punishment is not a deterrent and never meant to be. If you read the Torah, you will find that the one recurring theme/thought/intonation is to destroy evil by excising it from society.
This does not mean to send them to Club Fed to enjoy HBO, Golf & Tennis nor does it mean a Supermax.
It means destroying them. There is no reason to keep these people alive.

However.....While I am a PROponent of Capital Punishment, I have problems with prosecutors that are more interested in winning rather than justice. By definition this means that innocent people will be convicted and executed. Does that mean we should not execute evil? No, but we must be very careful not just in evidence but in witnesses, police, prosecutors and how public opinion is shaped and then how the public then applies pressure on all of the above.
The DC sniper's guilt was obvious but so was that he committed a premeditated evil act. By his premeditated act, he forfited his life.


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Bob in Queensland
Posted: Nov 12 2009, 09:38 PM


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Dan, while I obviously don't agree with you, knowing your religious beliefs I can see where you're coming from. The Torah and the Old Testament do have an "eye for an eye" philosophy so at least you're being consistent and true to yourself.

However, something that offends me is the hypocrisy of so many so called Christians--particularly the fundamentalist American variety--who somehow forget that, in THEIR bible, Jesus changed that to "turn the other cheek" and still clamour for the death penalty--revenge--in cases like this.


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