Title: Melky Cabrera
dangadd - August 15, 2012 06:58 PM (GMT)
Sespended for 50 games for positive PED test. Described on ESPN America as 'excessive levels of estosterone'. Thinks this affects the Giants chances of maiing play offs. Giants have 40-something games left according to commentators.
Not sure how I feel about this as a Giants fan.
Any comments?
Dan
Leemarlin87 - August 15, 2012 08:29 PM (GMT)
Big blow for the Giants and makes the pick up of Hunter Pence last month even more important.
Not the end of the line for them as far as post season chances go but it has given the edge to the Dodgers.
galraen - August 15, 2012 09:11 PM (GMT)
Well maybe % will be less aggrieved at the Royals letting him go now! :D
May help the Dodgers, but don't write off the D'Backs either.
ToffeeYankee - August 15, 2012 09:46 PM (GMT)
I really don't get how players can be so stupid as to take a banned substance... on purpose.
StewartB - August 15, 2012 10:19 PM (GMT)
| QUOTE (dangadd @ Aug 15 2012, 07:58 PM) |
Sespended for 50 games for positive PED test. Described on ESPN America as 'excessive levels of estosterone'. Thinks this affects the Giants chances of maiing play offs. Giants have 40-something games left according to commentators.
Not sure how I feel about this as a Giants fan.
Any comments?
Dan |
Didn't like him when he was with the Yankees.
Didn't like him when he was with the Braves.
Didn't know where he'd gone when he was with the Royals!
Didn't like it when the Giants signed him.
At least he only had a 1 year contract.
Pleased that multi-year extension deal talks fell through recently.
He gets a few hits, but basically, pleased he's gone and won't be back.
I know it seems like I'm sitting on the fence here, but I'm happy to see the back of him!
Tijani - August 16, 2012 02:15 AM (GMT)
I'm always disappointed when I hear about players getting suspended for failing drugs tests. At least they are catching people which has to be a good thing.
It is a big loss for the Giants and makes the NL West even more interesting as there isn't a lot between the top 3 teams in that division.
Kid Cuddy - August 16, 2012 03:58 AM (GMT)
As a Dodgers fan I would have to think this helps our chances of making the postseason. He's been arguably their best player this season & his loss will surely further weaken what can't be described as a powerful offence.
We still have 9 games remaining against the Giants which I do think will be the biggest factor in determining who wins the division.
Im disappointed that he chose to go down this path and it doesn't reflect good on our sport yet again.
AlextheBrave - August 17, 2012 09:18 AM (GMT)
Not a huge loss for the Giants, probably only cost them 1 win according season WAR so far, admittedly 1 win could be all the difference.
Interestedly what he has taken hasn't really had much of an effect in his power numbers, HR/FB is pretty much inline with his career figure.
fishandchippers - August 21, 2012 09:28 AM (GMT)
must have taken a drug that enchances your vision or something...he certainly has looked a different animal to the one that was at Turner Field.
A_C - August 21, 2012 03:30 PM (GMT)
It's sad the amount of ex-teammates who still backed him and had positive words to say. Don't they realize he's cheating everyone involved in the game, from fans to players?
Percentage - August 21, 2012 05:20 PM (GMT)
| QUOTE (galraen @ Aug 15 2012, 09:11 PM) |
Well maybe % will be less aggrieved at the Royals letting him go now! :D
|
Oh dear! Did i make it that obvious? :D
Just coming out of the shock of it & i'm actually quite gutted as the Melk Man gave me & my family hours of pleasure last season & warmed the cockles of my Royals heart,even in August i'm still trying to explain to my six year old daughter why Melky doesnt play for the Royals anymore (i wont tell her about this latest news!).
I havent even got the upper hand now on my fellow Royals fans on the US sites that i parade on occaisionally to whom i admonished for not being particularly grateful for what Melky did for the Royals last season.
In a funny sort of way the Royals have fluked the trade to what could turn out to be a big advantage as Jeremy Guthrie after three poor starts has really started to turn it on & looked very much like the pitcher the Baltimore Orioles enjoyed not so long ago.
Its been a bad week but getting rid of Jonathon Sanchez left me feeling less aggrieved with the Royals a couple of weeks ago but the Royals still have major problems identifying quality players!
Tijani - August 22, 2012 11:54 PM (GMT)
| QUOTE (A_C @ Aug 21 2012, 03:30 PM) |
| It's sad the amount of ex-teammates who still backed him and had positive words to say. Don't they realize he's cheating everyone involved in the game, from fans to players? |
I think it is difficult for the players to come out and criticize each other. They could easily be playing with each other next season and it could cause them a lot problems. The cynic in me would also say that there a lot more players out there that are taking PED's and it could have easily been them that were caught.
I think the website thing was just ridiculous.
Bartolo Colon has now also been suspended for 50 games. It will be a loss for the A's but they do have a lot of good pitching so should manage to cope.
A_C - August 23, 2012 07:37 PM (GMT)
| QUOTE (Tijani @ Aug 22 2012, 11:54 PM) |
| QUOTE (A_C @ Aug 21 2012, 03:30 PM) | | It's sad the amount of ex-teammates who still backed him and had positive words to say. Don't they realize he's cheating everyone involved in the game, from fans to players? |
I think it is difficult for the players to come out and criticize each other. They could easily be playing with each other next season and it could cause them a lot problems. The cynic in me would also say that there a lot more players out there that are taking PED's and it could have easily been them that were caught.
|
You're right, but it shouldn't be accepted by players. It'd be better for everyone if there was a much bigger stigma attached to it throughout the game.
Tijani - August 24, 2012 01:25 AM (GMT)
| QUOTE (A_C @ Aug 23 2012, 07:37 PM) |
| QUOTE (Tijani @ Aug 22 2012, 11:54 PM) | | QUOTE (A_C @ Aug 21 2012, 03:30 PM) | | It's sad the amount of ex-teammates who still backed him and had positive words to say. Don't they realize he's cheating everyone involved in the game, from fans to players? |
I think it is difficult for the players to come out and criticize each other. They could easily be playing with each other next season and it could cause them a lot problems. The cynic in me would also say that there a lot more players out there that are taking PED's and it could have easily been them that were caught.
|
You're right, but it shouldn't be accepted by players. It'd be better for everyone if there was a much bigger stigma attached to it throughout the game.
|
I agree. In an ideal world a lot of players would come out and condemn what he has done. It would be interesting to see how the players would react if the team lost a certain amount of wins if a player was found to be using PED's.
dangadd - August 25, 2012 04:39 PM (GMT)
One programme I watched this week discussed whether there should be greater punishments for taking banned substances. 50 games doesn't seem that much (2 months in reality). It just happens that at this time it's at a crucial point in the season.
I quite like the idea of punishing a team by removing wins. In these times of advanced statsitical analysis I guess it would be an option.
Interestingly the anti-doping Agency has removed Lance Armstorngs Tour de France titles in the last week.
Ronnie. - September 2, 2012 06:20 PM (GMT)
Experience tells us that there is a lack of condemnation from those also with something to hide.
Persoanly I'd be screaming from the rooftops at the injustice, here is a guy landing contracts based on cheating, thus taking opportunities away from honest players. When a guy blatantly cheats any players asked about it should roundly condem the practice, nothing less should do.
ToffeeYankee - September 2, 2012 08:54 PM (GMT)
| QUOTE (dangadd @ Aug 25 2012, 04:39 PM) |
I quite like the idea of punishing a team by removing wins. In these times of advanced statsitical analysis I guess it would be an option.
Interestingly the anti-doping Agency has removed Lance Armstorngs Tour de France titles in the last week. |
Slightly different when it's one person, as opposed to a whole team.
Removing wins is a horrible idea. You'd be punishing the other players nothing wrong (unless they had some part in it, of course). Just make the individual punishment more severe if anything.
Tijani - September 5, 2012 12:27 AM (GMT)
| QUOTE (ToffeeYankee @ Sep 2 2012, 08:54 PM) |
| QUOTE (dangadd @ Aug 25 2012, 04:39 PM) | I quite like the idea of punishing a team by removing wins. In these times of advanced statsitical analysis I guess it would be an option.
Interestingly the anti-doping Agency has removed Lance Armstorngs Tour de France titles in the last week. |
Slightly different when it's one person, as opposed to a whole team.
Removing wins is a horrible idea. You'd be punishing the other players nothing wrong (unless they had some part in it, of course). Just make the individual punishment more severe if anything.
|
I normally would agree but what is a good deterrent? A 50 game suspension doesn’t seem to be enough. Nobody knows the exact impact steroids have but players are happy to use them to try and gain an advantage and to then gain more money.
Would 100 games be enough? I’m not sure it would.
Giving a life ban after one failed test? Is a bit harsh considering it is possible to accidentally take some of these substances.
If someone being banned for taking PED’s also impact the team he played for then it would act as a major deterrent. You would be letting a lot more people down and it would certainly make players think twice. I would still be reluctant about doing it but I’m not sure there is a good solution.
Tijani - September 26, 2012 02:20 AM (GMT)
What does everyone make of Cabrera making himself not eligible for the batting title?Was it the right decision or is it going to cause more problems than it is worth?
galraen - September 26, 2012 09:53 AM (GMT)
A meaningless PR gesture as Cabrera's adjusted batting average is just .317, so he can't win the title unless Braun, Mcutchen, Posey and Molina all go into a tailspin.
Tijani - September 26, 2012 10:02 PM (GMT)
| QUOTE (galraen @ Sep 26 2012, 09:53 AM) |
| A meaningless PR gesture as Cabrera's adjusted batting average is just .317, so he can't win the title unless Braun, Mcutchen, Posey and Molina all go into a tailspin. |
I believe it's plate appearances and not at bats that make a player eligible for the batting title. A player needs 502 plate appearances and Cabrera has 501. If the Giants have a game postponed and they don't play it then he doesn't even take the 0 for 1 than he would be given which leaves him with a .346 batting average.
StewartB - September 26, 2012 11:57 PM (GMT)
| QUOTE (Tijani @ Sep 26 2012, 11:02 PM) |
| I believe it's plate appearances and not at bats that make a player eligible for the batting title. A player needs 502 plate appearances and Cabrera has 501. If the Giants have a game postponed and they don't play it then he doesn't even take the 0 for 1 than he would be given which leaves him with a .346 batting average. |
Yes, that's right. It would be embarrassing all round if he were to win the title whilst suspended.
galraen - September 27, 2012 08:31 PM (GMT)
My mistake, I read the qualifying requirements wrong.
In which case how can he 'disqualify himself', he can refuse to accept the award, but facts is facts, unpalatable as they may be. Unless MLB change the rules retrospectively, he will be the batting champion.
I can't personally see why they can't change the rules, simply insert a clause stating that anyone who is suspended can't qualify and make it effective from the start of this season.
StewartB - September 27, 2012 11:46 PM (GMT)
| QUOTE (galraen @ Sep 27 2012, 09:31 PM) |
My mistake, I read the qualifying requirements wrong.
In which case how can he 'disqualify himself', he can refuse to accept the award, but facts is facts, unpalatable as they may be. Unless MLB change the rules retrospectively, he will be the batting champion.
I can't personally see why they can't change the rules, simply insert a clause stating that anyone who is suspended can't qualify and make it effective from the start of this season. |
This is a rule change.
As I understand it from reports, he requested the MLBPA to negotiate with MLB a rule change to apply for this season that would lead him to be ineligible for the batting title.
I don't know what the rule is that they've introduced. For all I know, it could be that it has just added a condition to the qualification criteria that the player's name must not be "Melky Cabrera".
I hope that once they have more time, a more permanent rule change can be agreed along the lines you suggest that disqualifies anybody from any awards if they have served any part of a drug suspension during the season.
fishandchippers - September 29, 2012 09:59 AM (GMT)
in conclusion though the right outcome has been decided. It would have been a travesty to the sport if Melky had won the batting title.