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SCP - Containment Breach > General discussion > SCP 173 should be optional.

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Title: SCP 173 should be optional.


Capricorn - April 22, 2012 05:03 PM (GMT)
This game is absurdly scary and I am a HUGE fan of the SCP archives.
I love seeing all the different SCPs make appearances in the game... and that brings me to an issue and point.

SCP 173 started as the focus of the game, but it feels like allowing for more SCPs allows the game to grow greatly. Therefore, I propose, that SCP 173 should not escape containment at the start of the game, and should instead have a *chance* of appearing later so that there is a time and chance to encounter other SCPs and not mainly worry about him.

Don't get me wrong, I love SCP 173, but having the game throw different SCPs at you each time would be much MUCH spookier then just 173 every time with an occasional appearance of others. Exploring a seemingly empty and dark series of hallways and sometimes encountering horrifying things is arguably scarier then exploring a dark hallway and watching out for a guy you know is out there.

The Blink meter could appear after the fire time you spot 173 if he is released in your game (Or if you release him by mistake by errant button pressing) and blinking could happen without a meter before then.

So, in summary, the game would be improved if it were a SCP exploration game and not a SCP 173 game with cameos.

PS: Sorry if it sounds like I am asking you to do a good deal of additional work (I am) but no one can deny that having an SCP game with a bunch of the best SCPs would not be the best thing of all time.

PPS: 'Optional' may not have been the best word, when I mean "There should only be a chance of encountering SCP 173, and it should happen a little bit into the game", but that would not fit in the title.

Guest - April 22, 2012 05:20 PM (GMT)
For now, there is just a couple of SCPs presented and the sculpture is the main one in the game. So, as for me, the plot beginning shouldn't be changed.
And SCP 173's hunt never lasted more than 10 rooms in my walkthroughs. The player is the only survivor nearby and this thing wants to kill him, that's pretty logical. Than it may go away for a long time, as it were sometimes. But I think, that ability to choose SCPs presented in current walkthrough would be good, if there were more dangerous things.

KenOfAllTrades - April 22, 2012 07:44 PM (GMT)
I, for one, support your idea. Having SCP 173 as optional sounds more fun. I hate the idea of him popping up when I'm trying to explore. When I first got rid of him temporarily and just started exploring, the game seemed to be REALLY fun in a different way. This is just my opinion, but having him as optional is, of course, optional, so I don't really see any downsides to it except something along the lines of "Breaking the intended experience."

If you REALLY need him gone though, you can set his speed to something like 0.1.

QUOTE
And SCP 173's hunt never lasted more than 10 rooms in my walkthroughs

Huh. To me, he usually spawns either in certain rooms. And he usually shows up at random otherwise.

Slagar - April 22, 2012 10:36 PM (GMT)
I've never successfully gotten past 173 after trying many times. While I disagree that he should be optional, he sure is hard to avoid in his current state, especially when he was chasing me from behind and then teleported to the room ahead of me.

Course, In one playthrough I wandered around for quite a while without ever encountering him or 106, but I think that was a one time thing.

Being able to choose which SCP's appear would be an interesting idea, but it would radically change the game, so I don't think it's likely to happen.

Raphael - April 22, 2012 10:52 PM (GMT)
QUOTE (Slagar @ Apr 22 2012, 10:36 PM)
I've never successfully gotten past 173 after trying many times. While I disagree that he should be optional, he sure is hard to avoid in his current state, especially when he was chasing me from behind and then teleported to the room ahead of me.

This just happened to me. I kept my eye on the path he was on as I backed into a door, then CRACK.

I like how he shows up sometimes, but maybe lower his spawn frequency and make it so he can't show up multiple times in a room?

Snoipah - April 23, 2012 12:41 AM (GMT)
173 is how you get away as a class D, he kills the guard for you and leaves you be(for some reason)

Honestly? Hes fine as is.

Only flaw I see is why he lets you get away scot free.

Guest - April 23, 2012 08:05 AM (GMT)
QUOTE (Snoipah @ Apr 23 2012, 12:41 AM)
173 is how you get away as a class D, he kills the guard for you and leaves you be(for some reason)

Honestly? Hes fine as is.

Only flaw I see is why he lets you get away scot free.

I think that he should stay there after killing guard. Some lights are on so we could run away. Btw, sometimes 173 really remains in the first room after killing everyone. As for me, it always should be so.

MegaScience - April 23, 2012 08:35 AM (GMT)
I just think SCP-173 shouldn't be so common to spawn, but still exist in the current way. I just watched a 35 minute video of SCP Containment Breach, and 173 was in every over room for this guy. Spawns too often.

KenOfAllTrades - April 23, 2012 06:29 PM (GMT)
Well, it looks like the developer was thinking the same thing as the OP. There's now a way to make both 173 and 106 stop appearing, just be sure to read the changelog in 0.1.2.

Raphael - April 23, 2012 07:36 PM (GMT)
The thing is, without 173, the blink meter becomes pointless.

Guest010 - April 23, 2012 09:19 PM (GMT)
This game would work better if it had "areas" and a way to bypass each SCP. Each section of the game could have its own additional little mechanic like the blinking one for 173. Just a thought

KenOfAllTrades - April 23, 2012 09:25 PM (GMT)
QUOTE (Guest010 @ Apr 23 2012, 09:19 PM)
This game would work better if it had "areas" and a way to bypass each SCP. Each section of the game could have its own additional little mechanic like the blinking one for 173. Just a thought

Most of the game is (seemingly) designed around SCP-173, and I'd like it to stay that way. But the old man can be encountered in some SERIOUSLY inconvenient times, so I'd like him to be a bit more rare. He seems harder to retreat from.

Guest - April 23, 2012 09:47 PM (GMT)
There are also plenty of games where a monster chases you throughout the game. There needs to be a way to hang it up in each section so you can explore more.

Slagar - April 23, 2012 09:55 PM (GMT)
QUOTE (KenOfAllTrades @ Apr 23 2012, 09:25 PM)
QUOTE (Guest010 @ Apr 23 2012, 09:19 PM)
This game would work better if it had "areas" and a way to bypass each SCP. Each section of the game could have its own additional little mechanic like the blinking one for 173. Just a thought

Most of the game is (seemingly) designed around SCP-173, and I'd like it to stay that way. But the old man can be encountered in some SERIOUSLY inconvenient times, so I'd like him to be a bit more rare. He seems harder to retreat from.

Really? You can quite easily just run past him, and you don't have to go far for him to stop chasing you. 173 on the other hand is something you can't run past and you can't open some doors necessary to your escape without looking away, so I'd say 173 is harder.

I suppose it depends on your style of play though.

guest - April 23, 2012 11:14 PM (GMT)
I think without a doubt 173 should remain a very big part of this game, there isn't really much point to a blink system if he's "optional" or whatever, the creator said he wanted this game to be based more around 173 and puzzles regarding getting past it, and I'd like it to stay that way.

That's just me though.

Raphael - April 23, 2012 11:48 PM (GMT)
QUOTE (Slagar @ Apr 23 2012, 09:55 PM)
QUOTE (KenOfAllTrades @ Apr 23 2012, 09:25 PM)
QUOTE (Guest010 @ Apr 23 2012, 09:19 PM)
This game would work better if it had "areas" and a way to bypass each SCP. Each section of the game could have its own additional little mechanic like the blinking one for 173. Just a thought

Most of the game is (seemingly) designed around SCP-173, and I'd like it to stay that way. But the old man can be encountered in some SERIOUSLY inconvenient times, so I'd like him to be a bit more rare. He seems harder to retreat from.

Really? You can quite easily just run past him, and you don't have to go far for him to stop chasing you. 173 on the other hand is something you can't run past and you can't open some doors necessary to your escape without looking away, so I'd say 173 is harder.

I suppose it depends on your style of play though.

The problem with the old man lies in whatever rooms you're retreating through. He cannot be stopped or slowed, so if you have an airlock room behind you and you have to run down that little passageway to hit the switch? Tough luck. 173 in the room? Sucks to be you. It's not the difficulty of avoiding the actual SCP that's frustrating, it's the circumstances and inevitable death he can force you to have depending on where he decides to spawn. Even if you run past him, the same concept applies if the next door is one that can slow you down/has 173 in it.

squiggit - April 23, 2012 11:59 PM (GMT)
I don't think he should be optional. He's a good central figure to the game.

The only thing I really dislike about his inclusion as it stands is the way he teleports in order for certain puzzle rooms to work.

Granted, it's early alpha, so that's excusable.. but it's still obnoxious when I finish evading 173 to enter a new area only to have him suddenly be in front of me. I get he moves fast... but not that fast. I've even had instances of 173 chasing me into the room immediately before the smoke room only to have him immediately teleport as soon as I shut the door on him into the smoke room.

Speaking of that particular area... it'd be nice if trapping him inside a room with no interior exit mechanism actually slowed him down at all. It feels weird to seal him in there only to encounter him again two rooms later.

shairn - April 24, 2012 12:13 AM (GMT)
QUOTE (squiggit @ Apr 23 2012, 11:59 PM)
I don't think he should be optional. He's a good central figure to the game.

The only thing I really dislike about his inclusion as it stands is the way he teleports in order for certain puzzle rooms to work.

Granted, it's early alpha, so that's excusable.. but it's still obnoxious when I finish evading 173 to enter a new area only to have him suddenly be in front of me. I get he moves fast... but not that fast. I've even had instances of 173 chasing me into the room immediately before the smoke room only to have him immediately teleport as soon as I shut the door on him into the smoke room.

Speaking of that particular area... it'd be nice if trapping him inside a room with no interior exit mechanism actually slowed him down at all. It feels weird to seal him in there only to encounter him again two rooms later.

I locked him into the red room with the smoke and never encountered him for the rest of that session, so maybe it works?

GamerEntitlement - April 24, 2012 12:16 AM (GMT)
173 and the mechanics around him are what makes this game unique, I think he should definitely stay the main enemy.

Also feature creep could be a problem if the game strays too far away from the original design.

But if the game becomes long enough that it needs pacing, maybe there could be safe zones that 173 can't enter for whatever reason, maybe because it's well lit or full of cameras.

It would let the player safely do puzzles, play with something like the vending machine scp or cross over into another scp's territory. You could also cut the power in a safe zone and spawn 173 nearby at some point for a scare.

Also I noticed some people on youtube weren't making the connection between the concrete scraping sound and 173, if the sound could be worked into when it kills the Class D's or the guard it might help.

Shinway - April 24, 2012 02:05 AM (GMT)
173 should appear less often.
He is already in every room I go into, which I find sad, because If another scp were to come, I would be screwed regardless.

MegaScience - April 24, 2012 03:39 AM (GMT)
We just want 173 to not be so common as to see him every other room/hallway, or even in the next room/hallway you enter. You are staring at him, back out, close the door, run. Suddenly he's in front of you again. He can stay the main enemy, just make him slightly less common to avoid such awkward moments.

Bryan - April 24, 2012 04:50 AM (GMT)
There's also the times when you're running away from 106, and you come across 173, trying to avoid both is a bit much.

Capricorn - April 24, 2012 09:00 AM (GMT)
I'd like to point out how interesting it would be if this game were to start as a game about 173 and evolve into a game about all the SCPs, as 173 was the original and first SCP on the wiki.

GuestDude - April 24, 2012 11:08 AM (GMT)
One thing people have to realize is: Is the development team going for an exploration thriller game or a horror game with this little bit of SCP 173 bit of storyline in it?

Also, SCP 173 totally reminds me of the Weeping Angels from Doctor Who XD

Steelpoint - April 24, 2012 04:39 PM (GMT)
Right now I believe that 173 is mostly well balanced, he can be avoided but still presents a major threat to the player. The only thing I would rework would be to not have him teleport directly to the room ahead of me once I just evaded him, though I'm certain that this will be balanced later on in this game's development.

For 106 however I would like to see that doors slow him down significantly, and that the player can hide from him. Right now he currently pathfinds directly towards the player and can move through walls and doors with impunity.

Cabot696 - April 24, 2012 05:13 PM (GMT)
I have played through the game a few times now and I never encountered 173 outside of the single automatic airlock room in each play-through.

He's there every time. I just travel across the room and keep eye contact until the doors automatically close, leaving him in the room. I don't see him anymore after that.

This completely contradicts what other people have been describing. What's going on here? Why do I not see him more often?

Reginald - April 25, 2012 09:55 AM (GMT)
If you don't see much of 173, I'd say you'r case is rather abnormal. 173 spawns with a nonsensical frequency. Having 173 spawn in every second room greatly diminishes the atmosphere of the game, removing an aspect of unpredictability and cheapening part of the core gameplay by spraying it about willy-nilly. Having doorways constantly being blocked by 173 is quite frustrating, too. SCP-173 should be kept, but the frequency with which he spawns should be dealt with.

I find the exploration and challenge of escape quite enjoyable, but the 173 wad is blown far to quickly due to overexposure.

Raphael - April 25, 2012 09:56 PM (GMT)
Idea for 106: his article states that he takes longer to phase through liquid. Perhaps we can find containers of water and splash them onto a wall to slow his entry?

chitoryu12 - May 4, 2012 09:00 PM (GMT)
When some new SCPs can take their place, I'm fine with 173 being less common. Right now, it's a matter of making his frequency more random. Still have him actively pursue the player unless he/she can lose him around a corner, but have his teleportations be completely random as the game progresses.

I'd also suggest adding scientists or other D-Class personnel running around that 173 or 106 can attack and give you an opportunity to escape; security would just shoot you on the spot, probably.

rockfordbj - May 5, 2012 05:40 AM (GMT)
Am I the only one here who feels SCP 173 and 106 are fine as they are and are both easily dealt with if you just learn how to do it right? I died so much at first, but after playing the game a while I found points where I could even deal with them both simultaneously. I also found the odds of him appearing in a room right next to you relatively low, and never had an instance of there being 2 of them. I breeze right by both of them now, wasting barely any time at all.

Homeskillet - May 7, 2012 06:05 AM (GMT)
You know, I like SCP 173 but, from a gameplay perspective, it makes everything really stressful. If it's going to be hunting you the whole game, there really needs to be a way for you to have safe zones against it where you know it won't appear. Either that, or it needs to actually be hunting you through the facility (opening doors and such) so that you can "lose" it for awhile.

Obviously, the whole game is supposed to be stressful, but if the player isn't given breaks from it all they'll stop playing altogether. No matter how much I enjoy this genre, I know I would. That's a bad design choice.

Guest - May 7, 2012 08:13 AM (GMT)
QUOTE (Steelpoint @ Apr 24 2012, 04:39 PM)
Right now I believe that 173 is mostly well balanced, he can be avoided but still presents a major threat to the player. The only thing I would rework would be to not have him teleport directly to the room ahead of me once I just evaded him, though I'm certain that this will be balanced later on in this game's development.

For 106 however I would like to see that doors slow him down significantly, and that the player can hide from him. Right now he currently pathfinds directly towards the player and can move through walls and doors with impunity.

I agree with this, especially with doors slowing him down.

userxblade - May 7, 2012 01:17 PM (GMT)
Well I understand what you mean. You have to have him on your screen at ALL times or he will move... My idea is not to be optional but make encounter a bit more rare. I find myself coming across him every 2-4 minutes (excluding lock rooms).

Steelpoint - May 7, 2012 02:07 PM (GMT)
Currently all doors can only be opened by a switch, we can assume that 173 is using the same buttons to open the doors as you the player are. One way to implement, say a safe area, for the player to use as a HQ for the level they are on is to have it protected by a key card switch, meaning that the only way to open and close the door is to use a key card on the controls.

This means that 173 and other potential hostile SCP's or humans cannot open the door to get you. Providing a safe area to fall back to, or at least a buffer between you and it.

Of course SCP's like 106 can bypass these doors and get you either way, or if someone with high level clearance and is still alive could open the doors remotely!

*Edit*A good example of a safe zone is in Dead Space. On most levels there is a central point on the map where the player is generally safe and provides an area to save and reequip ammo and supplies. Though hostile Necromorphs (Evil monsters) could still get into this safe area and attack the player.

Kyithios - May 8, 2012 02:51 PM (GMT)
I happen to think it's great as it is. Sometimes, I encounter other what I guess is known as Slender Man before 173, and he freaks the hell out of me. It's like...I don't even know. He travels through walls, doors, and kills you with no problem at all. I'm fairly new to it, so is there perhaps an archive I can read about the SCP's at?

Micro - May 9, 2012 11:31 PM (GMT)
The wall travelling thing is SCP-106, an annoying bastard on its own.
The linked wiki contains all canon SCPs written to date. All that are in the game however, have their corresponding datasheets scattered throughout the facility as well.

splatterk - May 20, 2012 10:10 PM (GMT)
What I'd propose is to have different modes available, like 1 is you are a low-level SCP staff, doing your daily duties until you either fail to do one and get terminated or a breach happens, or you can be a Class-D, but instead of going to 173 every time, you try to endure the testing of as many SCPs as possible until you can manage to escape (this would present a problem if you were chosen as candidate for the blood-draining rug), or you are a KETER class SCP (one that has a method to escape) and you have to endure tests with Class-Ds until you find a way to escape.

sinatra - May 21, 2012 01:01 AM (GMT)
I like the idea, but why not compromise? Instead of removing (or making optional) 173, make it so it doesn't necessarily show up for a while. For instance, say that 70% of the time, when you start a new game, 173 won't be a threat before you pick up the level 1 keycard. 173 can still show up during the beginning, but the fact that it may or may not makes it more tense while still giving the player a chance to explore.

JewOnTheLoose - May 21, 2012 01:24 AM (GMT)
The sound of him being optional sounds like a cool option to add to the option menu, like you could pick what SCP's you can encounter.
Although that sounds like a lot of work. Still though, I think the games focus of 173 is fine already.

Sitromxe - May 21, 2012 05:48 AM (GMT)
In regards to choosing whether Specific SCP spawn...

...

No.

Choosing what SCPs you are going to be facing gives you an opportunity to prepare yourself, consequentially subtracting from the horror aspect

...

In regards to human controlled SCP spawning...

...

Perhaps, if an observing human was able to choose what would spawn whilst (or before) the player is progressing through the game.

That might be a fun idea...

Though near impossible to implement I'd wager.




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